I have doubts that [a femslash meme] would be very long-lived

[frogfriend]

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Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

I have no doubt there are, but that's because there's an amount of such people in any given fandom space above a certain population mass. I'd guess at least one of them is WTNVHA.

More common are the people who go "well, I understand wanting LGBT characters, but have you considered that straights need wish fulfillment het too and you have to wait your turn first? Stop being cringey and entitled towards TPTB. :)"

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

More common are the people who go "well, I understand wanting LGBT characters, but have you considered that straights need wish fulfillment het too and you have to wait your turn first? Stop being cringey and entitled towards TPTB. :)"

NA, but honestly, I'd classify that under what AYRT was talking about. Those people might not think in the exact terms of "dudes fucking is hot but irl lgbts are going too far" or think they're anything like those people, but I feel like there's... I mean, there's laughing at people who are super reaching and going straight into conspiracy theories and "the curtains in this scene prove this ship is canon" territory, but there also seems to be a depressing tendency for nonnies over there to be like, "well, it's fine if you have a gay ship, but wanting it to be gay IN CANON is entitled, and also if you want your gay ship to be canon you don't actually give a shit about representation, and besides, I don't know why anyone would ever want any ships they like to be made canon because it's always done so badly..." Which feels pretty bad and kind of does feel like they're going "you're acceptable if you just accept that your m/m and f/f is never going to happen and that that's fine or even preferable" sometimes.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

"well, it's fine if you have a gay ship, but wanting it to be gay IN CANON is entitled, and also if you want your gay ship to be canon you don't actually give a shit about representation, and besides, I don't know why anyone would ever want any ships they like to be made canon because it's always done so badly..."

Yeah, there's a whole lot of "if you want representation you're a DELUDED FANGIRL" or you don't know anything about movies/television or you're so naive you think these two characters are going to bang. It's probably kneejerk trolling, but it always, always pops up.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

Wanting ships to be canon is fine, but I do think that demanding a specific ship to be canon for representation is entitlement. I generally dislike mixing shipping and campaigning for representation because from experience it only hurts both. If you think that means I think "irl lgbts are going too far", you're welcome to do so. But boy, you'd be wrong.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

DA

I have a problem with that reasoning, and it's a big pet peeve of mine on FFA. I do agree that there can be a problem with shippers sometimes adopting/co-opting representation arguments when they don't really care about that, or turning it into a queerbaiting conspiracy theory. I would also agree that campaigning for a particular ship to be canon is often not effective.

But I don't think it's entitled to want to see representation on a show that you like, with characters you like. I also don't think it's entitled for LGBT fans to relate to a character or the way that the relationship between two characters is being depicted. I don't like the implication that we should just be satisfied with any character being gay, when in practice that often means background characters who don't have major romantic plotlines anyway.

When I was in my late teens, I watched a lot of shows and movies that I didn't really like because they had lesbian characters/relationships. I remember when those shows were a bigger deal because there was nothing else.

I'm a fan of Lucifer, and I absolutely think Maze/Linda should be canon. Because they act like they have romantic chemistry, Maze is canonically bisexual, and there have been tons of straight relationships on that show (including ones that seem much more unlikely than Maze/Linda). I don't think it's entitled to think that the relationship would make sense, or to feel like the "really close female friendship" angle the show has been going with feels a bit forced when Maze is canonically bi, has propositioned Linda, and has been shown to be willing to almost die for her. Why should I want some random background character to be gay, instead?

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

Again, you can want what you want, that's fine.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I definitely agree with this. I only start cringing when people start campaigning the canon creators to make their ship canon. And I don’t know if they’re even wrong or if that’s just the way fandom gets done now.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

Anyone who harasses the writers, actors, etc because thier ship isn't canon or isn't endgame is acting like an entitled brat. I don't care if you want a specific guy and a specific girl to hook up because you relate to one of them so damn much, they're basically YOU and they deserve happiness or if you're trying the same kind of thing with a femslash ship. There's an "it's only fiction, STOP" line, and you've crossed it.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

No one said anything about harassing or campaigning to the creators. Where did you and the above anon get that from that comment?

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

above anon

I don't know about harassment, but campaigning for your ship to be canon for representation, or arguing your ship should become canon for representation, is usually the context when people call shippers entitled.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

All the person you replied to brought up was "wanting it to be gay IN CANON is entitled". Is it entitled to just want a gay ship to be canon? Equating that and fighting with the crew or arguing nonstop honestly pisses me off.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

Then the anon was talking about something I've not seen happen like that.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

You've never seen anyone wish their ship was canon without harassing TPTB? Oh, please.

Re: wank containment area

[(Anonymous)]

No, I meant being called entitled just for wishing their ship would be canon.